BEAST currently has 5 of the top 25 2014 recruiting classes

[Bill Marsh]

How does the fact that if next week some team in the B12 gets some recruit from somewhere diminish the significance of the talent infusion already scheduled to enter the Big East in 2014. It would be different if most BE teams where still in a ton of recruiting battles for that uncommitted talent, but anyone following the trail this year knows that's actually not the case for the league on a whole.

It doesn't diminish the significance of the talent infusion already scheduled for the Big East. But these are rankings; by their very nature they are comparative. The higher ranked a player is, the bigger the impact he has on the rating of a recruiting class. For example, if a school successfully recruits the #1 player in the country and no one else, their class wills till be rated very highly because that one player will have an enormous impact.

[Bill Marsh]

These are early rankings and don't mean much. Most of the top 25 players by anyone's list haven't committed yet. When those dominoes start to fall, these rankings will completely change.

Looking at 24/7 sports list as a benchmark they have about 75 of the top 100 kids off the board. That being said the kids ranked in the top 10 are almost all undecided. It looks like the rankings will shift a little bit but I'd imagine it will mostly be the biggest schools grabbing the top 10 kids (Kentucky, Duke, UNC, Kansas, Indiana, Ohio State, Louisville, Florida) so if they aren't ranked they will be and if they are they will move up.

Rivals has 13 of their top 25 still up for grabs and Scout has 14 of their top 25 (or vice versa). At least that was the case when I checked a day or two ago. I think the rankings will shift more than a bit unless these kids go to programs that are already highly ranked. Whoever gets these players will immediately jump in the rankings.

[Bill Marsh]

These are early rankings and don't mean much. Most of the top 25 players by anyone's list haven't committed yet. When those dominoes start to fall, these rankings will completely change.

You know, commitments are far enough along for 2014 that about half of a typical top 25 (and 2/3's or more of a top 100) are already off the board. The rankings will shift, yes, but things have progressed far enough that current top classes won't be absent from the final rankings. So top 5/10/25 now doesn't mean they won't finish that high, it's still a good position to be in that reflects well on recruiting. If we had nobody with a top 25 class, at this point, we'd, rightfully, be pointing at what a disaster 2014 recruiting has been.

It's obviously a good position to be in. But the point is that these are the high impact players who are left, the McDonald's All Americans. Any single one of them immediately raises a program's recruiting profile. The problem for the Big East is that Isaiah Whitehead is the only recruit who's locked down by a BE school that's ranked in the top 35 on either of the two lists I checked. Unless the Big East picks up more of this level of recruit, they're going to be passed by the schools who sign these kids. As far as I can see, there are only a couple of the top kids remaining who are even considering Big East schools.

Not trying to be negative. Just trying to put the current rankings in perspective.

[TheHall]

How does the fact that if next week some team in the B12 gets some recruit from somewhere diminish the significance of the talent infusion already scheduled to enter the Big East in 2014. It would be different if most BE teams where still in a ton of recruiting battles for that uncommitted talent, but anyone following the trail this year knows that's actually not the case for the league on a whole.

It doesn't diminish the significance of the talent infusion already scheduled for the Big East. But these are rankings; by their very nature they are comparative. The higher ranked a player is, the bigger the impact he has on the rating of a recruiting class. For example, if a school successfully recruits the #1 player in the country and no one else, their class wills till be rated very highly because that one player will have an enormous impact.

Technically correct, but it's an academic point that's dwarfed by two other points that were implied by the OP:

1) The BE has already had a phenomenal recruiting season (signing day notwithstanding) period.
2) The success the old BE had on the trail has been continued by the NBE, a point not to be taken for granted.

Anything else borders on knit-picking IMO.

[Bill Marsh]

How does the fact that if next week some team in the B12 gets some recruit from somewhere diminish the significance of the talent infusion already scheduled to enter the Big East in 2014. It would be different if most BE teams where still in a ton of recruiting battles for that uncommitted talent, but anyone following the trail this year knows that's actually not the case for the league on a whole.

It doesn't diminish the significance of the talent infusion already scheduled for the Big East. But these are rankings; by their very nature they are comparative. The higher ranked a player is, the bigger the impact he has on the rating of a recruiting class. For example, if a school successfully recruits the #1 player in the country and no one else, their class wills till be rated very highly because that one player will have an enormous impact.

Technically correct, but it's an academic point that's dwarfed by two other points that were implied by the OP:

1) The BE has already had a phenomenal recruiting season (signing day notwithstanding) period.
2) The success the old BE had on the trail has been continued by the NBE, a point not to be taken for granted.

Anything else borders on knit-picking IMO.

Why is it nitpicking to pay attention to the facts?

FACT: The Big East has a commitment from one player listed in the top 35 by either Rivals or Scout.

FACT: Four other conferences have more than that.

ACC - 7 on Rivals, 6 on Scout
B1G - 4 on Rivals, 6 on Scout
SEC - 3 on both
AAC - 2 on both

I'd hardly call Big East recruiting "phenomenal" when they havent't come close to the ACC or the Big Ten in recruiting the players at the top of these lists. And they aren't involved with enough players at this level to catch either of these 2 leagues, whose recruiting actually could be called phenomenal with legitimacy.

The Big East has done well recruiting players in the top 100, but not so well recruiting the top 35 or even the top 50 where they only have 2 or 3 more coming in.

I'm not trying to put the Big East down at all. I hope they bash in the brains of these other conferences with the players they do have. There's more to life than recruiting and more to winningu bball games than recruiting.

I'm a huge Big East fan. I'm just trying to put the record in some perspective.

[GumbyDamnit!]

You are absolutley on target BillM. We can all pump out our chests now and say that no other conference has had the same success that we have had on the recruting trail or we can just wait until the entire class has been filled out and see. I fully expect that Nova will fall out of the Top 25 as soon as some of these Top 10 kids start delcaring.

Recruiting is a curious thing. Would you prefer to get a Top 10 kid, who most likely has the expectation of staying in college one year before bolting for the pros, the kids in the 20-35 range that think (along with their fans sometimes) they are Top 10 talent but probably just aren't (and will be sticking around a few years), or the guy in the 40-120 range that are solid players who are most likely going to stay for all 4 years and continue to develop? I think for long term success I would prefer if the BE landed lots of recruits in that 25-75 range, every year. I'll take the team with 5 or 6 seniors and juniors who were ranked 25-50 over a team with 5-6 Frosh and Soph's who were all ranked in the Top 20. I think the one and done Frosh can be helpful if you've got a well rounded team and need that final piece or if you are just so talented that you can step in day 1 and be one of the Top 4 or 5 players in the nation (see: K. Durant, Rose, Davis, etc.). So even though we may not get the mahjority of Top 10's, I'm not sure this is such a bad thing.

[hoyahooligan]

A lot of those top 10/top 25 kids are all going to end up at the same place. Duke, Kentucky, and Kansas are going to get multiple top 25 recruits and will jump to the top of the recruiting rankings. But Seton Hall and Georgetown's classes should still remain top 10 and I expect Xavier and Providence to remain in the top 20. Yes our teams will drop in the rankings, but we should still have at least 4 top 25 recruiting classes which is as good as the BE did on any given year. So I think the point is over blown to an extent.

[yorost]

You know, commitments are far enough along for 2014 that about half of a typical top 25 (and 2/3's or more of a top 100) are already off the board. The rankings will shift, yes, but things have progressed far enough that current top classes won't be absent from the final rankings. So top 5/10/25 now doesn't mean they won't finish that high, it's still a good position to be in that reflects well on recruiting. If we had nobody with a top 25 class, at this point, we'd, rightfully, be pointing at what a disaster 2014 recruiting has been.

It's obviously a good position to be in. But the point is that these are the high impact players who are left, the McDonald's All Americans. Any single one of them immediately raises a program's recruiting profile. The problem for the Big East is that Isaiah Whitehead is the only recruit who's locked down by a BE school that's ranked in the top 35 on either of the two lists I checked. Unless the Big East picks up more of this level of recruit, they're going to be passed by the schools who sign these kids. As far as I can see, there are only a couple of the top kids remaining who are even considering Big East schools.

Not trying to be negative. Just trying to put the current rankings in perspective.

Thank you, I never once imagined a blue blood picking up top targets would end up ranked ahead of any of our classes. I thought they just ranked our teams high by default.

The rankings will not "completely change" as you are saying. Saying that the rankings will change as recruits are signed, especially 5 stars is a little obvious, don't you think? Your post made it sound like a top 5 class could end up anywhere, that's just not true. Things are far enough along that any team ranked high now won't drop off the charts. Too many top 100 and enough top 25's are taken, who do you expect to vanish and who else to jump out of nowhere? Many of those top 25 recruits will go to the same places or to team already with classes ranked in the top 25. It's not like fifteen random schools will pick up those remaining 5 stars to go along with a 4 star or two to jump into the top rankings from out of nowhere.

edit: This whole argument is stupid, do you agree? The title of this thread even says "currently" ranked. 2015 rankings "don't mean much" yet and will "completely change" as the year progresses. That's what got people, I think most everyone in this thread understands these rankings will change and that top 5 now does not mean top 5 in the end. People aren't arguing that, it's the strength in which you stated it.

[TheHall]

Why is it nitpicking to pay attention to the facts?

FACT: The Big East has a commitment from one player listed in the top 35 by either Rivals or Scout.

FACT: Four other conferences have more than that.

ACC - 7 on Rivals, 6 on Scout
B1G - 4 on Rivals, 6 on Scout
SEC - 3 on both
AAC - 2 on both

I'd hardly call Big East recruiting "phenomenal" when they havent't come close to the ACC or the Big Ten in recruiting the players at the top of these lists. And they aren't involved with enough players at this level to catch either of these 2 leagues, whose recruiting actually could be called phenomenal with legitimacy.

The Big East has done well recruiting players in the top 100, but not so well recruiting the top 35 or even the top 50 where they only have 2 or 3 more coming in.

I'm not trying to put the Big East down at all. I hope they bash in the brains of these other conferences with the players they do have. There's more to life than recruiting and more to winningu bball games than recruiting.

I'm a huge Big East fan. I'm just trying to put the record in some perspective.

Why do you keep trying to create a false choice between winning & recruiting when no one said winning games isn't important. But more than any sport basketball is primarily about players, not coaches. You obviously have a negative bias towards the importance of recruiting, fine...But most people in cbb don't share that bias. Check the tweets/qoutes of coach mack, coach McD, coach Willard, coach cooley & coach Miller, when they received verbals from key commits over the last few weeks...no way do they share your bias & neither do their fan bases or scouts. Also go check the boards of Uconn (i believe u root for them), who is currently getting smashed on the trail and you won't see any hint that recruiting isn't absolutely crucial. This isn't hoosiers or the bad news bears, this is the BE, you ain't just going to coach 'em up to win this league, you need ballers.

The 2 highlighted quotes don't sound like a BE fan at all, especially given the importance of this upcoming season, given that no games have been played yet so all there is right now is recruiting.

[MUSeashells&Balloons]

Why is it nitpicking to pay attention to the facts?

FACT: The Big East has a commitment from one player listed in the top 35 by either Rivals or Scout.

FACT: Four other conferences have more than that.

ACC - 7 on Rivals, 6 on Scout
B1G - 4 on Rivals, 6 on Scout
SEC - 3 on both
AAC - 2 on both

I'd hardly call Big East recruiting "phenomenal" when they havent't come close to the ACC or the Big Ten in recruiting the players at the top of these lists. And they aren't involved with enough players at this level to catch either of these 2 leagues, whose recruiting actually could be called phenomenal with legitimacy.

The Big East has done well recruiting players in the top 100, but not so well recruiting the top 35 or even the top 50 where they only have 2 or 3 more coming in.

I'm not trying to put the Big East down at all. I hope they bash in the brains of these other conferences with the players they do have. There's more to life than recruiting and more to winningu bball games than recruiting.

I'm a huge Big East fan. I'm just trying to put the record in some perspective.

Why do you keep trying to create a false choice between winning & recruiting when no one said winning games isn't important. But more than any sport basketball is primarily about players, not coaches. You obviously have a negative bias towards the importance of recruiting, fine...But most people in cbb don't share that bias. Check the tweets/qoutes of coach mack, coach McD, coach Willard, coach cooley & coach Miller, when they received verbals from key commits over the last few weeks...no way do they share your bias & neither do their fan bases or scouts. Also go check the boards of Uconn (i believe u root for them), who is currently getting smashed on the trail and you won't see any hint that recruiting isn't absolutely crucial. This isn't hoosiers or the bad news bears, this is the BE, you ain't just going to coach 'em up to win this league, you need ballers.

The 2 highlighted quotes don't sound like a BE fan at all, especially given the importance of this upcoming season, given that no games have been played yet so all there is right now is recruiting.

While recruiting is important I think I'm going to have to quote the great Al McGuire:

"I don’t think any decent human being enjoys recruiting."

That being said I think Marquette has been lagging a little bit on recruits this year.