Is It Too Late For These Guys Reconsider

[Bill Marsh]

Admissions Rates at Highly Selective Public Universities:

22% - Cal Berkeley
25% - UCLA
31% - North Carolina
33% - Virginia
33% - San Diego State
35% - William & Mary
36% - UC-San Diego
39% - SUNY Stony Brook
41% - SUNY Binghamton
41% - Michigan
43% - Florida
43% - Alabama
44% - Colorado School of Mines
45% - Maryland
46% - UC Santa Barbara
46% - UC-Davis
47% - UConn
47% - Minnesota
47% - Texas
47% - UC Irvine
47% - SUNY College of Environmental Sciences & Forestry
50% - Wisconsin
51% - SUNY Albany
51% - Georgia Tech
52% - Penn State
52% - North Carolina State
53% - SUNY Buffalo
53% - George Mason

[nathanhm]

I would actually say the acc is a better academic conference than the big 10. Clemson, nc state, lousiville, and Fsu are no worse than Iowa or Indiana or Nebraska or michigan state. And duke, unc, uva, Boston college, notre dame, and wake are as good as northwestern and Michigan. Syracuse, Miami are just as good as Wisconsin and are better than Ohio state, Rutgers, Maryland, etc (which are more along the lines of Pitt, Georgia tech and Virginia tech).

You have six high end academic schools in the acc (nd, bc, duke, unc, wake, UVA). You have two in the big 10 (northwestern and michigan) which is the same as the big east (Georgetown and nova)

I totally agree that the ACC is a better academic conference than the B1G, they are much stronger at the top, although Louisville is considerably worse than any school in the B1G. I think the B1G is stronger than the just Northwestern & Michigan though. If the Big East is taking credit for Villanova being a top school academically, we have to give the ACC Georgia Tech and the B1G should get credit for Illinois, Wisconsin, and Maryland.

So for the ACC its 7 top schools, B1G 5 top schools, and the Big East 2.

7 / 16 = 44% -- ACC
5 / 14 = 36% -- B1G
2 / 10 = 20% -- BE

[marquette]

I believe the ACC is a better undergraduate conference than the B1G. I Believe the Big East is a similar or slightly better undergraduate conference than the B1G. However, it is apparent that the B1G is head and shoulders above everyone else (excepting the Ivy League) in graduate school education and research. There is no other conference that has the funding and scale of B1G research. Yes they are massive universities. Yes they have high undergraduate acceptance rates. This is a function of their undergraduate mission-to serve the states' post high school educational needs. The B1G also works well together on research, and shares resources between schools. The ACC schools all compete against one another. I am hoping that we can forge a similar relationship between the schools in the Big East and further develop as institutions of higher learning as well as have some competitive sports.

[Bill Marsh]

We can debate the comparative academics until the cows come home. It doesn't matter.

The point is that a school like Rutgers will never leave the Big Ten for a variety of reasons. One of those is definitely academic prestige. Regardless of what we think about undergraduate admissions, it's the mega universities' function as think tanks that generates their prestige. It's the research function that brings in the big name professors with star power. And that star power gives those universities prestige in academic circles.

The second thing is that research brings in mega bucks. Undergraduate education is irrelevant to this function. Whether we care about it or not, university presidents care and their Boards of Trustees care. Governors and other powerful politicians care. Business leaders care because much of that research is being done for the benefit of the biggest businesses in the respective states.

For the purposes of our discussion on athletics, the academic reputation that matters is on the graduate level and even beyond that to professors who never teach a class but are involved in full time research. The Big Ten through its alter ego, the CIC, has the most sophisticated inter university cooperative in the country. Once in the door, no university president is going to recommend leaving that regardless of whether athletics is losing money.

[Burrito]

I never wanted Rutgers or South Florida in the Big East to begin with. The football schools wanted them. The only school I wouldn't mind getting back is UConn. It's best two sports are our two best sports, Basketball and soccer.
And we have a 30 year history with them. Too bad they got involved in football.