Best Basketball Conference

[yorost]

I am a basketball guy, but I think vcu could make more money in football (with obviously their bball team still bringing in revenue) then they could make in basketball in the big east. Its a higher revenue sport. Also, Charlotte and Old Dominion are in Conf USA after about 2 or 3 years and with vcu's characteristics, I imagine they would have a easier time getting invited to a better conference than that with more $.

CUSA? Come on, that conference has been decimated from trickle down off the Big East. It was not some coup for those programs to join. Football is revenue, but it isn't necessarily profit. It's very expensive on its own and leaves a huge Title IX boot print on the athletic department.

[cm5yz6]

I am a basketball guy, but I think vcu could make more money in football (with obviously their bball team still bringing in revenue) then they could make in basketball in the big east. Its a higher revenue sport. Also, Charlotte and Old Dominion are in Conf USA after about 2 or 3 years and with vcu's characteristics, I imagine they would have a easier time getting invited to a better conference than that with more $.

CUSA? Come on, that conference has been decimated from trickle down off the Big East. It was not some coup for those programs to join. Football is revenue, but it isn't necessarily profit. It's very expensive on its own and leaves a huge Title IX boot print on the athletic department.

I bet Charlotte and ODU make more money in CUSA than they did in the A-10 / CAA

[yorost]

Maybe, they're leaving behind a nicer NCAA tourney payout in the A-10 to get something like an 800k bump in media revenue. It might be nicer overall, they did make the move, but switching to FBS did somewhat mandate a conference switch. You don't just profit by having football in FBS, the median profit line for the sport is negative, and transitioning programs are usually losing big. Teams are paying to try and hit big down the road or maybe get exposure. In the meantime they take buy games and survive.

[cm5yz6]

Maybe, they're leaving behind a nicer NCAA tourney payout in the A-10 to get something like an 800k bump in media revenue. It might be nicer overall, they did make the move, but switching to FBS did somewhat mandate a conference switch. You don't just profit by having football in FBS, the median profit line for the sport is negative, and transitioning programs are usually losing big. Teams are paying to try and hit big down the road or maybe get exposure. In the meantime they take buy games and survive.

I have a feeling that the units left behind by Memphis are better than those in the CAA (at least in ODU's case)

[yorost]

Do they get to share them? Does it even matter? Small media deals and some tourney credits don't just cover FBS costs. This discussion isn't about them,, it was about VCU adding football. I stand by what I said, if VCU joins our conference, football becomes less important for them. Doesn't mean it wouldn't happen, but they have less incentive to gamble on that route.

[cm5yz6]

Do they get to share them? Does it even matter? Small media deals and some tourney credits don't just cover FBS costs. This discussion isn't about them,, it was about VCU adding football. I stand by what I said, if VCU joins our conference, football becomes less important for them. Doesn't mean it wouldn't happen, but they have less incentive to gamble on that route.

Ok, and I stand by mine that VCU would, and will, make more money when they start their football program.

[yorost]

You can find any number of sources on the economics of FBS football. VCU will almost surely not profit on the move. They're after unproven intangibles that their basketball team is starting to give them. Teams can keep going to FBS, but there's only so much that can be taken overall.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/12/30/sport ... wanted=all

“The reality is that football schools who move up a division almost always lose even more money,” said Daniel Fulks, an accounting professor at Transylvania University who has spent the last 15 years as a research consultant for the N.C.A.A. “There’s not much defense of the economics in the short term or the long term. There are arguments for countervailing, intangible benefits — more national exposure, more admission applications, better quality students and increased alumni donations.

“That has definitely happened in some places, but it’s not a proven outcome. Some studies say it does work that way, some studies say it does not. There’s the risk.”

“The cost curve is extremely steep, and unless you’re in a power conference, the revenue is flat.”

“Of course, it’s an illusion that you can make money moving up. What they’re really trying to do is align themselves with the better-known institutions.”

But Lombardi sees a brewing quandary.

“The number of F.B.S.-level football teams is already too large to be sustainable,” he said. “And the teams at the top are a very strong, organized group. As more schools join at the bottom, it’s going to force the N.C.A.A. to restructure. They’ll have to start putting F.B.S. teams into categories.

[cm5yz6]

You can find any number of sources on the economics of FBS football. VCU will almost surely not profit on the move. They're after unproven intangibles that their basketball team is starting to give them. Teams can keep going to FBS, but there's only so much that can be taken overall.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/12/30/sport ... wanted=all

“The reality is that football schools who move up a division almost always lose even more money,” said Daniel Fulks, an accounting professor at Transylvania University who has spent the last 15 years as a research consultant for the N.C.A.A. “There’s not much defense of the economics in the short term or the long term. There are arguments for countervailing, intangible benefits — more national exposure, more admission applications, better quality students and increased alumni donations.

“That has definitely happened in some places, but it’s not a proven outcome. Some studies say it does work that way, some studies say it does not. There’s the risk.”

“The cost curve is extremely steep, and unless you’re in a power conference, the revenue is flat.”

“Of course, it’s an illusion that you can make money moving up. What they’re really trying to do is align themselves with the better-known institutions.”

But Lombardi sees a brewing quandary.

“The number of F.B.S.-level football teams is already too large to be sustainable,” he said. “And the teams at the top are a very strong, organized group. As more schools join at the bottom, it’s going to force the N.C.A.A. to restructure. They’ll have to start putting F.B.S. teams into categories.

That's all nice and great, but it doesn't change the fact that VCU is going to get football. The "illusion" of money, southern football preferences, or whatever you want to point to as the driving factor will enable it. Its going to happen. I actually thought we were finished talking about it.

[yorost]

Well, it would have been if you'd let it stand on something other than making money.

[cm5yz6]

Well, it would have been if you'd let it stand on something other than making money.

Well the AD or President (again forgot which one and don't feel like looking it up) said it was going to happen (which was actually my first point, not money). Its a huge public, southern university in a relatively large market which has a useable football stadium a few miles from campus. FBS football is cool. All the reasons that are needed nowadays.